Getting taught

I  sat out the women's movement, living in Switzerland,  and had a lot of catching up to do on that score when I returned to the U.S. in the mid 80s,  after having been away for almost 15 years. In my younger days, as I've mentioned, I got to know all kinds as a worker in low-level, low paid woman dominated occupations in San Francisco. So clearly a lot had changed: abortion was legal, if contested, women were getting more education and better jobs, and so on. Most importantly, women had found their voices and were speaking out after a period of oppression and regression. And in spite of the push-back, we are still talking and not likely ever to shut up again.

One group I did not pay attention to in the old days was highly committed Christians, Pentecostals and charismatics.  Religion has never interested me,  so I did not bother to learn what had been going on with faith communities in  the 70s and early 80s.  When I was an ESL teacher in the late 80's and early 90's my experiences with immigrants and refugees alerted me to the recruiting of Christians from the former Soviet Union that was being sponsored by white-dominated churches in the Portland area. All these people had to do was profess their faith and they were put on the fast track for immigration to the  U.S.  One of my former colleagues says this activity is still going on. 

Having pondered upon all of this,  I now understand why Clinton will win the nomination and the presidency. She appeals to serious Christians. They aren't going to go for Cruz, who is too mean,  or Trump, who is amoral.  Sanders is Jewish and obviously secular, probably an atheist, and this will become a focus of attacks on him, should he become the Democratic candidate. The right is holding back now, because they want him to win, but he won't. Clinton's reputation with African-American Christians, in particular, is unbreakable,  her faith is beyond dispute. This is no doubt the reason she carried the South. These constituencies  are just as strong in the urban north, which is probably the reason she carried New York State and will most likely carry all the states in play in next Tuesday's primaries.

It is a big mistake a lot of liberals make to discount the importance of religion, one I no longer make.

__________________________

Still learning  about my new I-Phone. It sure is a fun toy. I got many good shots of my index finger and  the Hilo waterfront on our way back from a swim at Richardson Beach yesterday. So now I know why I see so many people daintily holding fingers away from the device as they shoot.  These are some shots I winnowed out that are OK, taken at twilight. I didn't fool with them at all. They are kind of fuzzy, like the shots I got with my first digital camera.

And here is a photo from our place about an hour later, looking over at the bright lights of Hilo.

Our waterfront is unglamorous,  which is a good thing. We were going to go to the other side for a short holiday, but the cheapest room we could find at a nice resort was $250.00 a night. So we stayed home and went swimming at our local beach instead. Decent stuff for the public that is free is at a premium, so we are happy to have this resource that has escaped gentrification.

I'm going to be working on a campaign for a state legislature candidate and will be reporting about that on Facebook.

Comments

[Z]

On the Christianity, I am sure you are right or at least onto something.

[Hattie]

Really,on that I have been oblivious. Bad Berkeley upbringing.

[Brandon]

None of the five duopoly candidates appeals to me.

As for the Hilo waterfront: If you're talking about Banyan Drive and Keaukaha, the beaches are public, and the hotels have seen better days. Kamehameha Avenue used to be really built up till the 1946 tidal wave. Lots of wooden one- and two-story buildings.

[Hattie]

Brandon: I think it's a mistake to say that there is no difference between the Democrats and the Republicans. That is the kind of thinking that fractured the Democratic Party and helped to give us eight years of Bush II.

[Joared]

I guess by "serious Christians" you are referring to the "born agains", Pentecostals and charismatics. They have become a loud vocal force of extremists within Christianity, but I'm not so sure they would be Clinton oriented at all. They're rigid inflexible beliefs correlate well with Cruz, though the gentler candidates like Rubio apparently couldn't attract their numbers. So, I wouldn't count on them to go to Clinton if Cruz is out of the picture unless they were even more disillusioned with whoever becomes the Republican candidate. Geographics come into play since in some parts of the country I think they would go to Trump, if he's the candidate, before Clinton. On the other hand, if Trump "evolves" he just might drive them away.

I think it's important to recognize there are significant numbers of serious "silent type" more traditional ecumenical Christians in other denominations and many who have simply stopped actively participating but still share the belief system. These individuals embrace all religions, actively promote interfaith involvement with Jewish, Muslim and other religions, support social equality issues, and may be more inclined to vote for Clinton. I'm not sure what their numbers are since overall organized religion numbers are reported to be decreasing (even those born again extremist groups).

I still think there's a lot more to "shake down" before we have a good picture of how the election might go -- that Clinton and supporters should not become over-confident.

After the election you can tell me I didn't know what I was talking about -- or you can tell me now. ;-)

[Hattie]

Joared: Secular types like me (and maybe you) just don't get it about religion. The best I can do is look at how religion affects people, but always as an outsider and one who feels no desire to believe. I believe it is quite rare to find nonbelievers among people of color, and they would appreciate Hillary Clinton's sincere belief. It explains a lot of things about her, such as why she stuck with her husband and her persistence, verging on martyrdom,as a political figure. She believes in her special, historical, God given mission on this earth.

That book I mentioned, Blessed, by Kate Bowler, is helping me understand these matters.

[Ole Phat Stu]

I tell my Xian friends :-
"I don't believe in about 3000 gods; you don't
believe in 2,999. So you're nearly as Atheist as I am ;-)"

quoting Ricky Gervais there :-)

[Cop Car]

Never noticed Ms Clinton's being particularly religious. I think the appeal to some demographics is based on pragmatism.

[wisewebwoman]

I never thought that would be a factor, Hattie. But then again I'm staying well away from USian politics these days as we have enough local provincial politics to swamp us.

XO
WWW

[Hattie]

I don't think a non-believer could become President. Atheists are not popular in the U.S. Even Trump worships the lord in his own style.

[Anne]

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/11/05/7-facts-about-atheists/

[Brandon]

"I think it's a mistake to say that there is no difference between the Democrats and the Republicans."

Of course there are great differences between Ted Cruz and Bernie Sanders. Ideally, there would be multiple parties running candidates at all levels of government. Realistically, there are only two parties of significance, and we'll have to choose between their nominees. This is partly why Bernie is running as a Democrat, and he has gone far as a result. Even if he doesn't get the nomination, he has pulled Hillary leftward.

Over the years, I've liked Ralph Nader, Ron Paul, and Jim Webb, either for policy positions or for character. This time, no one comes close, but I'm still waiting for the dust to settle.

[Hattie]

Good discussion! Pretty busy but will maybe add something on Monday.

[Z]

Conservative Christians are very tolerant of non conservative Christians and after that, of anyone who has any religion, in particular any Abrahamic one and yes, even Islam. They like polytheism less, and agnosticism and atheism even less than that. The worst thing for them, though, is secularism, from anyone; the big problem is separation of church and state ... and also separation of individual from money

[Ruben Perez]

"separation of individual from money"

You nailed it Z.

Organized crime and organized religion are one and the same.

[Hattie]

Religious affiliations of U.S Senators
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_affiliation_in_the_United_States_Senate

[Brandon]

"I'm going to be working on a campaign for a state legislature candidate and will be reporting about that on Facebook."

Will this be soon?

[Hattie]

Brandon: Pretty soon. I'll email you about it.

[mage Bailey]

Goodness, you did stir up the pot here. I'm really enjoying the comments.

I lived through the women's movement believing that's the way things should be...equal. by the time we moved on to wages, I was mad as a hatter and missed it. The Conservative Christian movement caught me unaware. I thought all those politicians were spouting stuff so far right no one would pay attention, but boy was I wrong. It seems to be fading a bit out of the public eye now. Thank heavens. Still, I disagree with you about Hilary being Christian. I don't think she is, but she supports the causes many in the South espouse.

What a mess this election is.

[Brandon]

"I disagree with you about Hilary being Christian."

Hillary is Christian, a Methodist. But she's not given to religiose displays. Whatever appeal she holds is not due to religious affinity but her decades-long presence in Washington as First Lady, Senator, and Secretary of State.

[barbara]

Hattie -- Good points that you make about the religious right. Religious opportunists frighten me. I really need to read more about them. -- barbara